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Thread: Organ Rehearsal Space Construction & Set-Up Questions

  1. #11
    p Piano KC9UDX's Avatar
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    The idea is that for about $200 you can install a complete grid of heating tubes under the floor. You don't have to put anything in it. It someday you decide that you want radiant heat in the floor, if you didn't spend that $200, it will cost you thousands to retrofit. I know several people who heat large barns completely just by having a wood burning stove with a heat exchanger (or boiler) and circulating water or antifreeze through those PEX lines in the floor. You can get wood to burn for that purpose for free. More than one such person installed those lines without any real intention of ever using them.

    You can use various fluids for heating like that. Changing it regularly isn't really much of a concern, based on the working installations that I know of.

  2. #12
    Moderator jbird604's Avatar
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    Given the frigid cold snap we've having way down here in the south this week, some radiant heating pre-installed in the slab sounds like a mighty good idea to me! So many buildings have cold floors, even when the forced air heating system is going full tilt. If I were a young man building a house or organ studio to serve me for decades, I'd definitely go with in-floor radiant heating. (Just a thought.)

    Don't fail to make all the surfaces as smooth and reflective of sound as possible. It's easy to correct for excess reflection after a structure is built, by simply hanging a rug or tapestry here and there, but very expensive and difficult to go the other direction if your room turns out to be dead.

    Keep in mind that the flatter, smoother, more regular, less broken up, and more parallel your surfaces, the livelier the room will be. Any kind of intrusion, such a light tray or air duct, that breaks up the continuity of a wall or of the junction of wall and ceiling, will take away from the sonic liveness of the room. So try to enclose things within the walls or at least provide channels, such as the trays you mentioned, to carry wiring about the area.

    Also, the ridigity of the wall material affects the integrity of the sound more than you might think. Concrete, stone, and plaster are of course the gold standard, but often impractical. Half-inch or 5/8" Sheetrock is normally sufficient, but if money is available, a double-layer of sheetrock will give you a more resonant room with firmer bass. Thin 1/4" wood paneling very often results in a tinny-sounding reverb and a passel of annoying buzzes. That stuff is out of fashion anyway, but I used to see churches built with that on the walls, and the sonic result was always predictable.

    One more idea -- Why not add on a little apartment suitable for accommodating the odd visiting organ player friend

    (And yes, I know that some of us organ-playing friends are pretty odd indeed.)
    John
    ----------
    Church: Allen MDS-45 with Allen MIDI-DIVISION-II expander
    Home: Allen Renaissance R-230 with expanded four-channel audio and MIDI-DIVISION-II
    Shop: Bunch of organs in varying conditions, some good, some not...
    Half of an incredible two-man organ service team -- servicing all the major digitals in Arkansas churches
    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Birds...97551893588434

  3. #13
    ppp Pianississmo Marauder2003's Avatar
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    My house has 2 heat pumps. Unless they are faulty I don’t get much heat when the outside temp goes below 40 or so.

  4. #14
    Moderated crapwonk's Avatar
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    I would consider framing around the trailer storage area (wall and ceiling), and putting double doors for access into your rehearsal space. The idea of bringing cold and/or wet equipment into the space with all of your instruments scares me, both for humidity and temperature control.

  5. #15
    fff Fortississimo davidecasteel's Avatar
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    I second the idea of using multiple layers of drywall. The Sanctuary of my church has 3 layers of it. It also has slate floors (with some carpet) in the Nave and wood over concrete in the Chancel. We have a solid 2-second reverb time. (I would have liked more, but it's enough.)

    David

  6. #16
    Moderator myorgan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbird604 View Post
    One more idea -- Why not add on a little apartment suitable for accommodating the odd visiting organ player friend
    Shhhh. I want the city to think I'm building a garage with no plumbing. Of course, I think I actually might let you and your wife stay in the house.
    Quote Originally Posted by davidecasteel View Post
    I second the idea of using multiple layers of drywall. The Sanctuary of my church has 3 layers of it. It also has slate floors (with some carpet) in the Nave and wood over concrete in the Chancel. We have a solid 2-second reverb time. (I would have liked more, but it's enough.)
    Don't forget--this is a garage and not necessarily a performance space. It'll be my practice area. Yes, I want to have it sound as nice as possible, but I do have to keep on a budget which probably precludes more than one layer of drywall.
    Quote Originally Posted by crapwonk View Post
    I would consider framing around the trailer storage area (wall and ceiling), and putting double doors for access into your rehearsal space. The idea of bringing cold and/or wet equipment into the space with all of your instruments scares me, both for humidity and temperature control.
    Point taken. I will probably do some sort of remediation so a cold and/or wet trailer won't affect the organ. However, with the size of the garage (24'x32') I think any change in humidity or temperature will be remediated rather quickly. I know I plan to put some sort of ventilation in the house wrap so prevalent today. A fellow I work with had to remove his siding and cut holes in the house wrap in order to keep everything inside from rotting from moisture. The present garage where I've kept organs for the last 10 years or so, has varied in humidity from 20% to 85%, depending on the weather, humidity coming through the cracks in the concrete, etc. Based on that experience, I hope the presence of melting snow or a dripping trailer will be quickly regulated by the overall climate control systems that will be in place.

    Thanks, all for your suggestions and recommendations. I will heed all the advice proffered here and certainly thoughtfully consider it as budget allows.

    Michael
    Way too many organs to list, but I do have 5 Allens:
    • MOS-2 Model 505-B / ADC-4300-DK / ADC-5400 / ADC-6000 (Symphony) / ADC-8000DKC
    • Lowrey Heritage (DSO-1)
    • 9 Pump Organs, 1 Pipe Organ & 4 Pianos

  7. #17
    mf Mezzo-Forte Larrytow's Avatar
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    Michael,

    That is a pretty cool project you are starting. It will be really nice to have a storage place for all your big organs, as well as a facility to work on them as needed. The others have pretty much covered the things that came to my mind, so I won't bother to repeat them.

    I will tell you to check out a site ( not sure if I should put in a link, but there is no competition with this one ) called Garage Journal. That forum very informative on all things garage / shop related, including new builds. Lots of great information can be found there regarding all portions of new construction and remodeling. One warning though : once you get looking at all the things there, you could be on that site for a LONG time.
    Regards, Larry

    At Home : Yamaha Electones : EX-42 ( X 2 ), E-5AR ( X 2, one in parts, one not ), D80 ( in parts ), FX-1, FX-20, HS-7T ( in parts ), EL-25 ( X2, one chopped, one not ). Allen organs : T12-A, T-12B, ADC-6000D. Baldwin 626. Hammond Concorde. Lowrey CH32-1. A bunch of other Synthesizers and Keyboards. At Churches I play for : Allen Q325 ( with VISTA ), Hammond A105, Baldwin 720T, Several various small and medium size pipe organs of many sorts and builders.

  8. #18
    Moderator myorgan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larrytow View Post
    I will tell you to check out a site ( not sure if I should put in a link, but there is no competition with this one ) called Garage Journal. That forum very informative on all things garage / shop related, including new builds. Lots of great information can be found there regarding all portions of new construction and remodeling. One warning though : once you get looking at all the things there, you could be on that site for a LONG time.
    Larry,

    Well, it's a L-O-N-G weekend! Thank you so much for the reference. I believe that will help with another problem I'm trying to solve.

    To keep the stairs from using valuable floor space, I'm planning to get a track installed in the peak of the cathedral section, and have a lift installed with, maybe, a 4'x6' basket to lift things like speakers or an organ (approx. 1/2 ton, or around 1,000lbs.), and other equipment to the attic truss space. It certainly beats carrying speakers up the stairs! So far, I've only found DIY projects or industrial lifts using bridges, etc. I'm sure someone makes them, I just haven't found them yet.

    Now that I have a domain to search, I'll see what comes up. Thanks again for the link!

    Michael
    Way too many organs to list, but I do have 5 Allens:
    • MOS-2 Model 505-B / ADC-4300-DK / ADC-5400 / ADC-6000 (Symphony) / ADC-8000DKC
    • Lowrey Heritage (DSO-1)
    • 9 Pump Organs, 1 Pipe Organ & 4 Pianos

  9. #19
    p Piano KC9UDX's Avatar
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    You can build whatever kind of lift you like. Just don't tell Uncle Sam.

  10. #20
    mf Mezzo-Forte Larrytow's Avatar
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    Michael,

    I know will you find information about various lifts on that site - I have seen posts about that sort of thing on there. Not sure just what section, but there are some. Another thing is that, just like this site, Google seems to be a better way to search there using the site name and whatever search terms, rather than using the built in search function. Enjoy !
    Regards, Larry

    At Home : Yamaha Electones : EX-42 ( X 2 ), E-5AR ( X 2, one in parts, one not ), D80 ( in parts ), FX-1, FX-20, HS-7T ( in parts ), EL-25 ( X2, one chopped, one not ). Allen organs : T12-A, T-12B, ADC-6000D. Baldwin 626. Hammond Concorde. Lowrey CH32-1. A bunch of other Synthesizers and Keyboards. At Churches I play for : Allen Q325 ( with VISTA ), Hammond A105, Baldwin 720T, Several various small and medium size pipe organs of many sorts and builders.

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