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Thread: Is It Considered A Sacrilege?

  1. #11
    ff Fortissimo Silken Path's Avatar
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    I'm curious about this, too. My plan is to eventually give my Kimball to my mom, and she's had trouble pumping it when she tried. I actually like the variability of pumping, in a Hollywood mad scientist way. So if I electrified it, I'd want to keep the ability to pump it.
    -- I'm Lamar - Rodgers W5000C - Conn 643 Theater - Hammond M3
    -- 1899 Kimball pump organ (forum thread) - can't find headphone jack!
    -- Public domain hymn search: https://songselect.ccli.com/search/r...t=publicdomain

  2. #12
    Moderator myorgan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by samibe View Post
    It could be that I just don't know enough about pump organs or suction pumps, but it seems like an "expression" pedal could be attached to a regulator valve or a variable speed suction pump to achieve a reasonable amount of expression.
    My Estey 2M/P has been connected to a motor which runs the bellows, and it also has an expression (Swell) pedal which does affect the sound quite a bit. Unfortunately, there a couple of ciphers I haven't been able to live with, so I haven't played it much, and probably won't until I get it repaired.

    Michael
    Way too many organs to list, but I do have 4 Allens:
    • MOS-2 Model 505-B / ADC-4300-DK / ADC-5400 / ADC-6000 (Symphony)
    • Lowrey Heritage (DSO-1)
    • 9 Pump Organs, 1 Pipe Organ & 4 Pianos

  3. #13
    ppp Pianississmo HiDesertHal's Avatar
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    I would also want to retain the pedal function even if it were electrified.

    Hal

  4. #14
    pp Pianissimo samibe's Avatar
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    I would imagine that the knee levers or one of the pedals (maybe?) could double as expression control for when the suction pump is running. When the pump is not running, the knee levers or pedal would function normally. It might be useful to have a way to disengage the pump expression when it is not in use. I don't have any more concrete solutions to making this modification, but I might look into doing this on my mom's pump organ sometime after I get it fixed-up and running correctly.
    Sam

    Yamaha P22 (not enough pedals)
    and an Allen ADC-4500 ... for now.

  5. #15
    ff Fortissimo Silken Path's Avatar
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    I asked Arndt Organ Supply what the optional "check valve" for their suction units did. The explanation was that it cuts off the suction that would bleed back to the suction unit when pumping the pedals. I'm still having a hard time imagining this, like "cuts off to where?" and "can the suction pump still work without airflow, like would happen if one is pumping?" One would not want the suction pump collapsing the bellows, I'd imagine, or wasting the energy of pumping the bellows just to lighten the load of the suction pump instead of flowing through the reeds.
    -- I'm Lamar - Rodgers W5000C - Conn 643 Theater - Hammond M3
    -- 1899 Kimball pump organ (forum thread) - can't find headphone jack!
    -- Public domain hymn search: https://songselect.ccli.com/search/r...t=publicdomain

  6. #16
    ppp Pianississmo edkennedy's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    External pump check valve;
    A check valve is needed on the blower hose if you have an external centrifugal blower on the organ, and you want to be able to hand pump it.

    The foot bellows have check valves in the bellows so the air only goes one direction. Once you have vacuum in the reservoir, it will stay there when you stop pumping(assuming the valves are working and there are no other leaks). This also means that if you have externally supplied vacuum, air will not bleed in to the reservoir through the foot pedals.

    If your external vacuum pump for the organ is a centrifugal blower (similar to a vacuum cleaner), it does not have any valves in it. Vacuum is maintained in the organ only by having the blower continuously running. If the blower is shut off, air will easily go the opposite direction and eliminate the vacuum in the reservoir.
    This is not a problem if you only use the external blower, but if you want to be able to pump the organ, a one way or check valve needs to be added to the blower line. Without the check valve, the blower hose will let air in to the organ as fast as you can try to pump it out.
    Ed Kennedy
    Current Organ - Conn 645 Theater

  7. #17
    ff Fortissimo Silken Path's Avatar
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    Thank you, Ed, for a great explanation. Actually, I ordered the unit from Arndt and have it working with the organ now. The details are in the organ thread linked in my sig, but I basically have the suction unit, with the check valve, connected by 2 /12-inch flexible ducting into the organ. So far I haven't been able to out-pump the suction pump, but I did make up some orifice "discs" (round wood plugs with different size holes bored in them) to adjust the vacuum. That's working fine - it's like having power steering on a car for the first time. I mainly have two favorites I'm playing with. One just barely sounds without pumping. This is what I use at night. The other is still not loud, but it's louder. It helps when I use a lot of stops + the Vox Humana. And, yes, the pump is centrifugal.
    -- I'm Lamar - Rodgers W5000C - Conn 643 Theater - Hammond M3
    -- 1899 Kimball pump organ (forum thread) - can't find headphone jack!
    -- Public domain hymn search: https://songselect.ccli.com/search/r...t=publicdomain

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