View Full Version : Expression Pedal Order - Left to Right??
02-05-2006, 07:55 PM
On a digital organ that has two expression pedals: one for SWELL and one for GREAT/PEDAL, which one should be on the left-hand side, and which one should be on the right-hand side?
On Friday I tried out a used instrument I'm considering (Rodgers 751) and the Swell expression pedal was on the right, and the Gt/Ped on the left. Is this correct? It SEEMED backward to me. (I'm wondering if it could be switched).
It seems to me that the Gt/Ped should be on the right, and the Swell pedal should be on the left.
What does the AGO spec say about this? (Does a Gt/Ped expression pedal even exist in the AGO spec, I wonder?)
Great/Pedal on the left and Swell on the right is my preference.
I don't know the Rodgers 751, but the pedals can be programmed to suit you on some digital organs.
If you've got the owner's manual check the possibility out. If there isn't a manual, try and beg, borrow or steal one, because a dealer will try and convince you that anythings possible in order to get a sale.
Let the buyer beware! Do your homework first.
02-05-2006, 11:12 PM
>Great/Pedal on the left and Swell on the right is my preference.
Great minds must think alike!
I've invesitaged used: Allen and Rodgers, and new: Content, Phoenix and Ahlborn-Galanti. It certainly is a challenge to try and sort out all the various claims the various vendors make. The fact that there is a fair amount of negative comments made about competitors doesn't help either.
On the three manual pipe organ I play, the order is:
So, perhpas that's why I expect the SWELL pedal to be on the right, when there are just the two pedals.
Perhaps it's an easy matter to change. I do wonder what the AGO spec says.
Can anyone look this up? They don't seem to have an on-line pdf, but snail mail such information. Good grief!
02-06-2006, 12:07 AM
<u>Most</u> organs I've played have:
Gr/Ch/Ped -- Sw -- Crs
But I've played a few that have the far left and middle shoes switched.
My new Baldwin has the above order, and I believe the one before it did as well. Also, the Reuter/Allen at St. Matthias' as the same above order.
I would assume that that is most common?
02-06-2006, 01:12 AM
I'm not actually clear about what you mean.
>Gr/Ch/Ped -- Sw -- Ped
On a digital organ, the Great and Pedal are often paired together on the same expression pedal, so, does the above mean:
So for a two manual: Gt/Ped--Sw--Cres.
02-06-2006, 01:19 AM
First off, I wasn't thinking. I meant to write <u>Gr/Ch/Ped -- Sw -- Crs</u>
Simply, it all depends on the instrument itself.
My baldwin at home is NOT playing yet, so I'm going by the labels over the shoes. The label says: Gr/Pos -- Sw -- Crs, I'm not sure if the pedal is enclosed or not.
However, I've played galanti organs that have
Gr/Ch/Ped -- Sw -- Crs with the great and the pedal and the choir all on one shoe.
It's nice for accompanying choirs - you have control over everything.
A two manual organ (if the great was enclosed) would have Gt/Ped -- Sw -- Crs, with the exception of the principal, which would usually be unenclosed.
Just depends. :)
02-06-2006, 02:37 AM
>Gr/Ch/Ped -- Sw -- Crs
I thought that was what you meant, but always best to check . . . .
02-06-2006, 03:05 AM
02-06-2006, 08:49 PM
AGO specifies: the choir shoe (or great show in a small two manual organ) is to the left of the swell. Crescendo is to the right of all others, and slightly higher.
Many e-organs put the great under expression, even if 3 manuals, and usually the pedal, choir, and great express on the left shoe. Sometimes a control is provided to unexpress the great & pedal.
02-07-2006, 02:08 AM
That's what I was looking for - what the AGO spec says. It appears that the Rodgers 751 follows this practice. I'm going to see the instrument again on Friday, and maybe with the proper mindset, it will seem fine!
02-13-2006, 07:48 PM
The actual AGO spec says the following (I had to re-type it because Adobe wouldn't let me cut and paste the text):
Crescendo shoes: ... Swell shoe to be located directly in front of the E-F gap. Choir or Positiv shoe to left of swell. Solo shoe to right of swell. Register-crescendo shoe invariable to the right of all others, and slightly raised. Great shoe in small two-manual organs, where great is enclosed, to replace choir or Positiv shoe at left of swell shoe.
There was a link to the full AGO spec (PDF file) elsewhere on this board.
02-14-2006, 10:44 AM
"There was a link to the full AGO spec (PDF file) elsewhere on this board."
I've tried various search strings, but can't locate it.
PS - the factory rep that was helping to show the organ said that the AGO spec contains a picture of a console, and that the console is a Rodgers. That's kind of funny, if true!
02-15-2006, 12:03 PM
The Search option on this forum seems to act on its own once in a while, or else it doesn't do the logical thing when someone enters a text string and presses ENTER. I searched for this yesterday and it came up with 240+ hits. It didn't seem to matter what I typed in either.
Anyway, use the Search option at the top of the screen. Enter:
and press the SEARCH button. The first entry (by me) has a link to a web page. Cut and paste that into your browser's address line and press ENTER. On that page you will find an alphabetic list of organ-related terms. One of them, probably AGO, has something in it like "you can find the AGO specs here..." and if you notice carefully, one of the words is blue. If you put your mouse cursor over it and click on it, up comes a PDF file of the AGO specs, or at least a good piece of it.
If there was somewhere on this forum to store files, it should be put there, but I haven't found such a place yet.
02-15-2006, 08:29 PM
AGO Specs. PDF (http://organ.wicks.com/pdf/agoconsole.pdf)
02-17-2006, 12:13 AM
Whether or not you can swap contacts or whole pedals all depends upon how it is constructed. On old analog organs, this was usually possible. On digitals, it depends. It might all be on a circuit board and not subject to change.
02-17-2006, 02:13 AM
I would have thought that digitals would be easier to swap, since they are usually modular, are they not? In fact, I doubt you would actually have to swap the pedal, but merely change the plugs running from the processor control board to the pedal. This would have the effect of changing the order of the pedals. The only thing that might bugger you up is if the cable run tolerances are too short!
03-01-2006, 11:06 PM
Did anyone else notice that the AGO specs for height of lowest manual above Middle D of pedal is 29 1/2" while the diagram shows 29 1/2" using the the middle manual?
I'm assuming the diagram is incorrect.
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