The Organ Forum

I'm following Sb32's advice to start a new thread.

Well - as for REPTON - it's nice enough, in fact I'd go with "above average", but not nearly as good as JERUSALEM in my opinion, which must be Parry's masterpiece.  (please feel free to disagree or correct me if there's another Parry tune as good)  BTW I can say as a non-organist, or rather a not very good, non-pro organist, Jerusalem is the most difficult standard hymn score I've ever seen. So many accidentals!

That being said, I agree that REPTON is worthy of more attention on this side of the pond.  Good suggestion Soubasse32.

 

I'm so glad you like REPTON.  I was reluctant to post that sample from Cyberhymnal - all of their samples tend to sound like a cheap Casio coupled with a choir of submerged drowning people! 

My favorite incarnation of REPTON is the original from Parry's oratorio "Judith", titled Long since in Eygpt's plenteous Land.  The piece gives me chills!

The boychoir sings rather low in their range, and there are rapturous interludes (unfortunately missing from the hymn).

For an audio sample, check out selection #2 on this page: http://www.classicsandjazz.co.uk/tssite/homepage.do;jsessionid=294CC82A5DDD0F466ACFD65B75B3F98B?ruleset=release&id=50191213

Here are some wonderful renditions on YouTube:

An all-out arrangement:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxGsuybnUmw&feature=related

This one is guaranteed to produce a tear - the fellow is singing a duet with a recording of himself as a boy chorister - I'm glad he uses those beautiful interludes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zj3PQY5BPnk&feature=related

A truly lovely rendition:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ManuuP97u2Q

And perhaps the ultimate - a favorite hymn in a favorite setting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faNij71hh7o&feature=related

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Soubasse32

Oh yes, I love JERUSALEM as well!

Here is a little treat:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoIggVp41j4

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Soubasse32

"sound like a cheap Casio coupled with a choir of submerged drowning people!" ROTFL!  AGREED!  Actually when I first heard it, I was unimpressed, but decided to go find a better sounding version.  Cyberhymnal II really out to feature links to actual performed versions; a lot of midis sound awful.  Thanks for the links I'll check them out.

 

 

 

 

Our new ELCA hymnal lists 3 sets of texts for REPTON.  It is a lovely tune.  One text is "Give Thanks for all the Saints", the second is "How Clear is Our Vocation, Lord" and the third is "He Comes to Us as One Unknown".  The last, for Advent, is the text that got this tune on the map so to speak.  I love the "Dear Lord and Father" text to this tune too.  Jerusalem has made a big splash these last couple of years too.  Not only is it our hymnal with a justice/peace text, there are concertato's and handbell arrangements now published.  Gee the Lutherans are getting so Anglican!!!

A newer tune for us is Raabe, paired with the text "Day of Arising".  An Easter text, we sang it last week.  It's a Carl Schalk tune, whom we Lutherans love!!!  Also lovely is Union Seminary with 2 texts, one for the time after Epiphany and the other a Pentecost text.  It's by Harold Friedell.

My other favorite 'new' tune, at least to our hymnal is "Michael" by Herbert Howells.  It's well paired with the text "All My Hope on God is Founded".

Both tunes are unmetered, but flow nicely and their melodic patterns are quite interesting.  They're not necessarily ones that a regular congregant would pick up in one hearing, but I think that's part of what makes an enduring melody.  Something with a bit of substance that catches in the brain to be sung all week! 

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Holtkamp/Parkey pipe organ
Galanti Praeludium home instrument

Thanks for reminding me of MICHAEL - a very nice tune, probably not known to many in the U.S.

I have played this, somewhere.  But I just cannot remember the circumstance.

I worked with an English conductor for many years - it is quite possible he programmed this hymn at one of our concerts.

I hope folks don't mind my posting so many YouTube links - you can click on them if you like, or not.  I like having some quick references to the hymns we are discussing...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3nO6hqwCKQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Z177T-JuFI

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Soubasse32

One last comment about Repton (and more specifically "Dear Lord and Father"): I find it virtually impossible to resist all kinds of vulgarama effects in the last verse as we go from "Speak through the earthquake, wind and fire" to "O still small voice of calm".

I had a brief flick through my hymnals and found a number of tunes that I like, but have rarely heard sung in other Churches. I think these deserve more attention:

Highwood 11 10 11 10 - R R Terry (Typically to the words: O perfect love...)

This is a beautiful tune, but it must be sung fairly slowly to get the most out of it. Makes an ideal communion or offertory hymn IMO - nothing too bombastic or rousing.

Surrey 88 88 88 - Henry Carey (Sung to: The Lord my pasture shall prepare).

Nice jolly hymn in three time, hardly hear it sung and it doesn't feature in many hymnbooks either.

Jesus My Lord 88 88 88 - anon. (Sung to: Jesus my Lord, my God, my all)

This is a beautiful hymn tune that does not feature in any of the popular hymnbooks. I have it in a hymnbook that was a private print run, but I've yet to see it anywhere else. Also makes a nice communion or offertory hymn. Has anyone heard this one before?

Tune: B-flat, G, E-flat | E-flat, D, E-flat | F, B-flat, A-flat |, A-flat, 2G |        where 2 = minim, no number equals crotchet, hymn in 3/4 time

Old Hall Green LM - John Crookall (O come and mourn with me a while)

Saffron Walden 86 86 - Arthur Henry Brown

Anyone heard of these? Do you like any of them?

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Currently own:
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sb32, thanks for posting all those wonderful YouTube versions of "Repton".  How well I know the organ and acoustic of Westminster Abbey.  What a treat is was to watch that!

Repton is certainly a favourite of mine, and two hymnals on the "other side of the pond" have it that I know of: Episcopal Hymnal (#653) and the CS Hymnal (#50). 

A tune I'm extremely fond of is "Wolvercote".  (NEH, #420)  Don't know if it's very often sung in the States, though you'll find it in the Episcopal Hymnal (#289) and the CS Hymnal (#250).  

 

 

Soubasse, please continue to post Youtube links. Just when you think the world is going to hell in a hand basket, up pops Aled Jones doing  a duet with his younger self. Beautiful!

Hi nullogik,

Highwood, Surrey and Saffron Walden are all fairly regularly sung here, although to different words than those you have suggested. I like all of them. 

Si 

nullogik, none of the tunes you listed are in the UMC hymnal here in the US; I have never run across them in my other experiences, either (such as the various military hymnals, which do include a wider variety of hymnody).  I have already commented on the other (dislike) thread that WOLVERCOTE is also not available to us.

Having attended a few Anglican services in GB and here, I have come to the conclusion that there is very little shared hymnody between them.  Only at Christmas and Easter (a little) do I find the same words married to the same tunes.  We do have a lot of Charles Wesley hymns (66 in the current hymnal, I think, but we did have more in the previous edition--the survey under way does ask if more Wesley hymns should be included, and I answered YES).  Our American-born tunes are probably denounced in the Mother Country as too simplistic, rustic, and crude, requiring no ability to sing them.  Guilty, your honor.  I know that most UMC congregations would be totally at sea to attempt most Anglican tunes; it was not so when I was a youth--Methodists then sang lustily and many in the pews were able to read music for singing fairly well and we did handle more difficult tunes much better.  We regularly sang EBENEZER, for example, and BRYN CALFARIA.  I think that among true hymns, CWM RHONDDA is still one of the most popular; I was gratified to find that the latest edition of the hymnal restored the bass voice run up to the 7th at the end of the penultimate section (and our bass section just loves it!).  I have nightmares about the church at large attempting to sing SAGINA, which is 88888888 and practically none of the sections are the same as ony of the others.  I love the tune, but I think it is relegated to being sung by the choir as an anthem (we have a beauty!).  Most of the old Welsh tunes (except CWM RHONDDA) are losing their following.  The churches are doing more and more of the "religious nursery rhymes" that someone mentioned.  (How many times do you have to sing "My God is an Awesome God" before He gets the idea?  I think hymns are best based on scripture, either directly or from good paraphrases--they should teach.  Praise hymns (bad terminology) and choruses don't say anything except "God is great" (shades of "Allahu akbar") and there is more to faith than that.

Sorry.  I'll get off my high horse now.  I just get so frustrated with the crap and pap that is being sung in church these days.

David

Well as time goes on it's becoming obvious that this thread title has no real meaning across cultural and geographic divides. One man's obscure is another man's stalwart, and I've no idea at this stage what could be considered obscure or otherwise.

That said, I found myself humming Picardy this morning (used for "Let all mortal flesh keep silence" around here). It's a tune I like, and it doesn't seem very common. It's in a minor key, which is always a bit different for hymns, very singable, and congregations seem to respond well to it.
 

soubasse32:

I'm so glad you like REPTON.  I was reluctant to post that sample from Cyberhymnal - all of their samples tend to sound like a cheap Casio coupled with a choir of submerged drowning people! 

 

You realize cyberhymnal merely plays the sounds on YOUR computer. . . so if you think it sounds bad. . . well. . . it's actually your fault. :)

 

That said, it IS a little bizarre that they include the voices in the mid. I would just use the GM Pipe Organ. 

SimonS:

Well as time goes on it's becoming obvious that this thread title has no real meaning across cultural and geographic divides. One man's obscure is another man's stalwart, and I've no idea at this stage what could be considered obscure or otherwise.

That said, I found myself humming Picardy this morning (used for "Let all mortal flesh keep silence" around here). It's a tune I like, and it doesn't seem very common. It's in a minor key, which is always a bit different for hymns, very singable, and congregations seem to respond well to it.
 

I am not surprised at this at all.  Even within a city you'll have differences from congregation to congregation. I think it depends on the past experience and preferences of the music staff and/or pastoral staff.  What ever they like and are familiar with becomes the language of the congregation.  If the staff is sensitive enough, they also know what the congregation will respond to.  We use the Sundays and Seasons guides, which correspond to the lectionary, to guide our hymn selections.  But it ultimately comes down to what we know and are willing to teach.

There is such an explosion of new hymnals that have resurrected tunes, retired others and even brought in all of the world tunes.  Then too, with the projected screens  and printed service guides, along with the copyright licensing, almost anything is fair game to use.  Our music lexicon has gone global!

We sing the Picardy tune with different texts a couple of times a year, usually during Advent, on the last Sunday of Epiphany as we retire the Alleluia, and usually as a communion hymn during the season after Pentecost. (I find it interesting on occasion to end the tonic chord on the last verse in the MAJOR, depending on the hymns placement, and the service it's sung in.) 

 I've found this thread interesting and have seen some tunes I'd never heard of before.  Let's keep it going!!!

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Holtkamp/Parkey pipe organ
Galanti Praeludium home instrument